[computer-go] Congratulations to LeelaBot2 and to CzechBot

[Don Dailey]

Jeff Nowakowski wrote:
> On Mon, 2008-05-12 at 21:14 +0200, Gian-Carlo Pascutto wrote:
>   
>> But I still categorically object to the stance that it's the bots or the 
>> programmers fault that it forfeits on time. As log as lag is not 
>> compensated there is no way to avoid time losses, even if the bot always 
>> moves instantly. You can at best improve the odds of this not happening.
>>     
>
> I disagree.  
I think you both agree on the same thing but are casting it 
differently.   You can "almost"  ensure that you don't lose on time by 
sacrificing some playing strength and playing very quickly.    

In my opinion, to play the best game possible against evenly matched 
opponents,  you have to push your time control to the point that you 
WILL lose a small percentage of games on time, at least in the face of 
unpredictable network lag.     Against weaker players you should be more 
conservative and not push too hard.   

That's part of the reason why I added a modest time gift to CGOS.   It's 
a rough (and imperfect) attempt to make network lag less of an issue for 
those programs that wisely make aggressive use of their time.  

- Don


> Playing games over the Internet introduces a lag problem.
> Stuff like timeseal solves one problem and introduces others.  How much
> time are you willing to let the opponent lag?  This can introduce
> scheduling problems and also accusations of cheating to intentionally
> introduce lag.  This accusation was somewhat common when I played on
> FICS, and disabling timeseal was a frequent topic of discussion.
>
> I think "playing on the Internet without lag compensation" is one of the
> realities a bot coder should just take into account, the same way a
> coder must take into account different rulesets depending on the
> tournament.  I liked Jason's approach to measuring the lag.
>
> Occasionally somebody will lose a game because of lag.  *shrug*, it
> happens.
>
> -Jeff
>
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