endgame (Was [computer-go] Re: Should 9x9 komi be 8.0 ?])

[steve uurtamo]

i'm just saying (and perhaps i'm misunderstanding something here)
that lots of playout depth, and therefore lots of simulations are required
to see *any* advantage to playing out a ko.

s.


On Sun, Mar 2, 2008 at 3:17 PM, ivan dubois <dubois_ivan at yahoo.fr> wrote:
> Mogo is already very strong at endgame and certainly plays perfectly near the end of the game. The more advanced the program, the sooner it can play perfect endgame.
>  But correct ko threats playing has nothing to do with the playout part : Since it is a strategic concept that involves global understanting, It is handled by the UCT tree part.
>
>  ----- Message d'origine ----
>  De : steve uurtamo <uurtamo at gmail.com>
>  À : computer-go <computer-go at computer-go.org>
>  Envoyé le : Dimanche, 2 Mars 2008, 20h25mn 33s
>  Objet : Re: [computer-go] Re: Should 9x9 komi be 8.0 ?]
>
>  a few subtleties --
>
>  it's possible for a machine to play a perfect endgame, and my
>  guess is that machines will play perfect endgames before people
>  do, although most pros are excellent at the endgame.
>
>  counting ko threats and utilizing kos effectively is tricky in playouts --
>  kos can naturally extend a playout very, very far beyond where the
>  actual advantage would be taken in a non-ko situation, and the likelihood
>  of getting this far often enough in playouts to see the advantage is going
>  to be difficult for machines without a lot of domain-specific knowledge.
>
>  different humans are often good at different stages of the game, and
>  making up a few points in the endgame, or getting a massive lead in
>  the beginning of the game may be possible, convincing a computer
>  player of something that isn't true -- either that it's nearly guaranteed
>  to win, or nearly guaranteed to lose.
>
>  all that having been said, i'm quite impressed with how well these programs
>  are doing.
>
>  s.
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